S1E7 The Trouble With Normal
Season 1 | Episode 7
Episode Description
Welcome to Everything Is A People Problem; a podcast that explores the connections between business, culture, and community, uncovering how every business problem has a people-centric solution with host Dia Zafer-Joyce.
In this episode, Dia applies Emotional Intelligence to neurodivergent and introverted individuals, elevating the importance of leadership diversity for both problem solving and visibility.
Episode Transcript
Hi there. Welcome to Everything is a People Problem, a podcast that explores the connections between business, culture, and community, uncovering how every business problem has a people centric solution. I'm your host, Dia Zafer-Joyce. Let's talk about people.
Hi, I'm Dia, and welcome back to Everything is a People Problem. Change is one of the very few things that are constant in the world, which, if everything around us is changing, then naturally we should change as well. One of the things I said early in the podcast was that I was hoping to watch myself, my opinions, change as I did this experiment and this project, and this is one of those moments.
I used to make fun of my husband because he uses Marco Polo. And when he uses Marco Polo, he will listen back to his own Polos, so he might've recorded something for his family and then he'll immediately listen to it again, and I thought maybe that was just the actor in him because he spent 10 years of his career as an actor and director and teacher, and I realized that I kind of do the same thing. As soon as my episode drops, I will listen to it on the way to work, mostly because, as musician, I learned that you should listen to your recordings in many different environments; through a speaker, through your headphones, through your car radio, you should use all of these tools and mechanisms so that that way you get a very well rounded view on how you're performing. So, I was listening to my last episode, which was around emotional intelligence, understanding your own emotional well being as well as those around you. And I realized that my research and the observations and suggestions I shared were largely focused on individuals who are comfortable with active listening in these social skills as it is.
But what about neurodiverse leaders? What about introverted leaders? We need leadership diversity in order to have diverse thought and solutioning. So what do we do about Emotional Intelligence and diverse individuals in leadership positions? I want to quickly refresh us on the importance of Emotional Intelligence, not because I want us all to become the same type of leader, but I want us to acknowledge that the attributes of someone with a high EQ or emotional quotient has a benefit to the business and will help make businesses successful.
In a comparison study between Emotional Quotient, EQ, and Intelligence Quotient, IQ, psychologist Daniel Goleman found that while we are born with both EQ and IQ, that the Emotional Quotient may play a more important role in determining someone's success. Emotional Intelligence accounts for about 90 percent of attributes that set high performers apart from their peers who have similar technical skills and knowledge, but EQ, similarly to emotional intelligence, can be broken down into four categories: self awareness, self regulation, social awareness, and relationship management. And where EQ really comes into play is in conflict management, and conflict is unavoidable in the workplace.
Let's talk about conflict. Across the globe, employees spend 2. 1 hours per week resolving disagreements. In the United States, that actually rises to 2. 8 hours per week, and managers spend six hours per week, so about 15 percent of their time, resolving work conflicts. So with all these disagreements, how do we have a good outcome? Well, 90 percent of a conflict’s resolution is determined by the message delivery or the tone of voice. So, those four components of EQ are all leveraged when it comes to minimizing the impact of a conflict. So emotional intelligence does play a very strong part in effective management.
So the common denominator to effective leadership is Emotional Intelligence. Let's talk about diversity in the leaders themselves, and that's going to focus on both neurodiverse leaders and introverts. In the 1990s, sociologist Judy Singer coined the term “neurodivergence.” She actually created this as self advocacy. She was teased as a child because she had a different way of interpreting her environment, and she went on to study and identify that no brain is the same, and everyone has a unique combination of abilities and needs. She identified that neurodiversity itself provides an opportunity for society to learn more about people and about how the brain operates differently than what is considered typical or normal, because really, what is normal anyways?
Neurodiversity, according to Harvard Health, is the idea that people experience and interact with the world around them in many different ways. There's no one, “right” way of thinking, learning, and behaving. If you walk away with nothing else about neurodiversity, remember this: It's based on the framework that different is not the same as deficient. Being neurodivergent is like having a superpower. There are so many incredible strengths when you think differently. Neurodivergent people tend to be more honest and straightforward. They're very observant and detail oriented. When they're given a goal, they focus. And, I say all of these strengths not as someone who is on that spectrum, but as somebody who does a lot of research to try to understand what I don't naturally know, and I've managed many people that have fallen into this spectrum, and that is a challenge. It is a good thing to do because it gives me opportunities to learn humbly as a leader, but at the same time, it gives me a chance to elevate these individuals to show how there is strength in diversity.
If the key output of Emotional Intelligence is conflict management or conflict resolution, then any leader, any individual, needs to practice the skills that will allow them to be successful in generating a positive and productive outcome. Before we start solving all the world's problems and providing suggestions on how to overcome and subvert societal expectations on leaders, we probably won't get to all that in this episode, but maybe someday, I do want to talk about introversion.
Introverts as compared to extroverts, get their energy from their own company, by recharging by themselves. Someone who is introverted may be perceived as withdrawn or shy, but, in fact, they process differently. Again, not deficiently, differently. Introverts tend to concentrate on a single activity, very similar to neurodiversity. They also analyze situations carefully and maybe think before they speak. Extroversion gets paired up often and incorrectly with effective leaders. Just because someone can function well in a social situation doesn't mean that they should be put in a leadership position. That is a very deep topic that we could rabbit hole into on people who are incorrectly placed in leadership just because of how they present. But extroverts can be impulsive. They can make quick decisions and not process in the way that an introvert does. There's an incredible book by Susan Cain. It's called “Quiet, The Power of Introverts in a World That Can't Stop Talking,” and there's a quote that I love from her, which says, “Extroverts are more likely to focus on what's happening around them. It's as if extroverts are seeing ‘what is’ while their introverted peers are asking ‘what if.’”
In 2013, there was an interesting study done on social conformity and it found extroverts are more willing to go along with majority opinion even if it's wrong. Extroverts were found to be more likely to succumb to social pressure as compared to introverts and the research concluded with the higher the pressure, the more extroverts that conformed their responses to one another. In comparison, introverts showed no difference in response conformity, regardless of it being a high or low pressure situation.
As a matter of fact, I am an introvert. I am sure that can be surprising, and I have had some people revolt on me and absolutely disagree, but I get tired. I love leading my people. I love working with people and collaborating with people because of the outcome, not the process. I need my alone time. I love the podcast because I'm sitting here doing it by myself. I don't have to do it with anybody else, but I enjoy this space where I can recover so that I can dive back into the work that creates meaning in my life. Talking to people, leading people, negotiating with people is a learned skill for me. I was not always good at it. Which brings me back to emotional intelligence being a learned skill. It is not something someone is naturally born with, but we work at it to become better at it. And we can do that in ways that don't glorify extroversion or make emotional intelligence and emotional quotients be synonymous with high socially functioning individuals.
How do we do this? Number one, we need to self assess. There are Emotional Intelligence tests out there that you can take to be able to identify personal areas for improvement. And when you take this test, it can acknowledge both your strengths and weaknesses, so you can identify where are you already successful? What are elements of Emotional Intelligence that you embody today so you can elevate those? And then, where do you need to work so you can put some intentional, conscious effort into those opportunities?
The next thing we do is we pause. That might be pausing before responding in a conversation, maybe pausing after taking an emotional intelligence test to do some reflection, but pausing allows you to acknowledge your feelings, pay attention to those around you, and allow your brain to interpret and respond mindfully. It's a good reminder to just take a moment and breathe and it's incredibly important If the conversation is charged or maybe not going in the direction that you're hoping for it to go.
And finally, we practice. There are 1, 000 different ways where we either are failing or excelling in Emotional Intelligence, and that's going to look different no matter your individual makeup. What we commit to is improving ourselves as people and as leaders, and most importantly as people leaders.
I want to finish with, it's not a story, I guess it's more of an anecdote, but I've had the absolute joy in my career to coach individuals into managers, and one such individual was talking to me about early days in their career when they considered leadership, but were told that in order to be a manager, they needed to talk more. Basically, they needed to get in a room and flex their opinions, whether it was necessary to be speaking or not. Just in case you're wondering, that's bad feedback. That was bad advice, because that is quantity over quality, and as a leader, you should know when to speak, when to ask questions, because when you do that with intention, then your voice becomes louder than if you're just talking all the time. So, diversity in leadership is so important, not just so that we have different leaders in the room, but also so that we can see different leaders lead and have examples for our future leaders who don't fall into a neurotypical or traditional view of successful management.
You've just finished the latest installment of everything is A People Problem. You can find episode transcripts with work cited on diazaferjoyce.com/podcast. Find me on Instagram @EverythingIsAPeopleProblem, and tell me what you thought of the episode. If you like what you heard, please subscribe so that you're notified when new weekly episodes become available. Once again, I'm your host, Dia Zafer-Joyce, thanks for joining me and see you next week.
Today’s episode was written and produced by Dia Zafer-Joyce. It featured insights and statistics from Audit Board, CEO Today, CNBC, Forbes, Forbes Health, Gitnux, Simply Psychology, and Very Well Health, and Royalty-free music provided by Sarah, the Instrumentalist from Epidemic Sound.
References
Corbett, Holly. “3 Ways to Manage Conflict in the Workplace.” Forbes, Forbes Magazine, 30 Apr. 2023, www.forbes.com/sites/hollycorbett/2023/04/30/3-ways-to-manage-conflict-in-the-workplace/?sh=6c6ce50d3223.
Fabritius, Friederike. “A Neuroscientist Shares the 4 ‘highly Coveted’ Skills That Set Introverts Apart: ‘Their Brains Work Differently.’” CNBC, CNBC, 7 Feb. 2023, www.cnbc.com/2023/02/07/neuroscientist-shares-coveted-skills-that-set-introverts-apart-their-brains-work-differently.html.
Gregory, Erin, and Deborah Courtney. “What Does It Mean to Be Neurodivergent?” Forbes Health, Forbes Magazine, 20 Feb. 2024, www.forbes.com/health/mind/what-is-neurodivergent/.
Griffiths, Chris. “10 Highly Successful People You Didn’t Know Were Neurodivergent.” CEO Today, 29 June 2022, www.ceotodaymagazine.com/2022/06/10-highly-successful-people-you-didnt-know-were-neurodivergent/#:~:text=Yet%20stigmas%20around%20neurodiversity%20remain,they%20are%20given%20the%20opportunity.
Guy-Evans, Olivia. “Introvert vs. Extrovert Personality: What’s the Difference?” Edited by Saul Mcleod, Simply Psychology, 29 Jan. 2024, www.simplypsychology.org/introvert-extrovert.html.
Lindner, Jannik. “Must-Know Workplace Conflict Statistics [Current Data].” GITNUX, 23 Dec. 2023, gitnux.org/workplace-conflict-statistics/#:~:text=Workplace%20Conflict%3A%20The%20Most%20Important%20Statistics,-Globally%2C%20the%20average&text=In%20the%20US%2C%20it%20rises,their%20time)%20solving%20work%20conflicts.
Rudy, Lisa Jo. “Are You Neurotypical or Neurodiverse?” Verywell Health, Verywell Health, 8 Aug. 2023, www.verywellhealth.com/what-does-it-mean-to-be-neurotypical-260047.
Yuen, Nancy. “The Neurodiverse Leader: The Power of Emotional Intelligence in Leadership.” AuditBoard, 6 June 2023, www.auditboard.com/blog/the-neurodiverse-leader-the-power-of-emotional-intelligence-in-leadership/.
